I thought Benelli made shotguns?

they do but heres the bikes

http://www.benelli.com/page.do

Futureistic, but i like 'em! Especially the TNT.

those bikes look awesome!

Yeah too bad their bikes suck.

i dont know the first thing about good bikes, they are all the same to me except for the cool looking ones. what are some good bike companies?

Mostly the japanese ones. You just buy italian bikes for character.

what are the average prices for an exotic bike, like a ducati or something?

The Benellis cost up to about 45 grand, a ducati 999R, arguabily the best bike in the world, costs about 30 grand. And a top of the line Japanese sportbike won't cost you over 10 grand.

Fuck motorcycles! Hurray!

Anyway, this kid...I hope he didn't buy TVR, do approximately nothing, then dust his hands and walk away.

So ducatti is just a character bike i don't think so.

Basically it is. You can get the same if not more technology in a japanese bike for a lot less money.

ya, there is more technology in a Civic than in a Lambo, but you buy the Lambo because it is italian...and there is an in-explicable charm to italian machinery, an inate beauty...if a bike could ever be beautiful, it would be italian.

and this Nick guy who bought TVR, he seems to have a genuine passion for cars, he did go ahead with the Sagaris

is $30,000 worth it for a bike? i was thinking about it, and there aren't any fantastic cars for $30,000... is the best bike in the world worth it?

You can't go faster for less money.

comparatively how fast are the smaller jap bikes like suzukis? they do cost a third of what the Ducati costs, are they significantly slower?

Actually they're faster in a straight line. A jap bike can easily outrun any italian bike in out and out speed contests.

However when everything gets twisty the Ducati tends to have the ability to catch up.

have you driven a bike? what does braking in the corners feel like? Does it feel controlled, i've watched bike races on TV and it always seems like they are just about to lose it.

Never ridden one sadly but I know my way up and down them somehow. I would have gotten one, but then I got wankeled.

Racing a bike isn't about who has the better machine, its only about who has more balls. The bikes you see on TV are NEVER going 10 10ths instead they're down at 8 or 8.5 which is one of the reasons why its always so competetive. You can't hardly split them with a knife.

rather have a harley

what do you mean 10/10 or 8-8.5/10 ..?

Yeah you would.

i can't understand how a bike can corner and brake kinda hard at the same time, i would be scared shitless. You can notice the back squirming a little bit in races, in a car its controllable, in a bike...not so sure.

10 10ths is a term that refers to how close you are to the limit. 10 10ths is 100% at the limit. 8 10ths is only 80% of the lmit. ect ect

Its just a racing term.

how would someone control a bike in a slide?

It doesn't.

In motorcycles understeer is a "lowside" when the front end slips out and the bike falls on its side and slides. Oversteer is basically a "highside" when the back end snaps upright with such force it pitched you over the front and the bike runs you over.

what is it called when the back starts to come around? or does that not happen? i've never seen it happen, but i always expect it too.

That's the highside. MotoGP riders actually can point the front and back wheels in different directions but that is so close to death only the best riders in the world can handle it.

yea that is what i was talking about, those people must be fucking insane...
what sort of aerodynamics go into a bike for top speed situations? i heard that some Ducatis are designed so that they dont go over 120mph or so because the rider's neck will start to hurt. is this true?

Aerodynamics on bikes are kind of pointless. The rider basically has more drag than anything else and they are never in one position.

how is it that some bikes can 200 mph, seems unlikely...

Hunker down behind a windscreen and hold tight.

i was just thinking about that one vid where the guy in the 400hp hayabusa was doing wheelies at like 200mph.

I doubt he was wheelieing at that speed.

have you seen the vid? he was going around 200 i think, you could see the speedo. but that could have been fake.

The turbo busa one was faked. It was a new bike with the old 200+ mph speedo.

They can and will go that fast with a turbo attached, you just don't want to wheelie at that speed because it'll pitch you backwards.

o, lol. was he actually going 200mph at all? he seemed to be moving pretty fucking fast.

Probably the 190 range or so. Its hard to tell.

Off topic, but any comments on the 250R? I'm considering getting one to learn on just for puttering around town.

The Kawak?

By golly, yes!

Faster than walking, gets good gas mileage, and is good to learn on. You can outrun MOST family cars on it.

Ah, sounds good, I'm still researching them a bit, but it seems like a good choice.

Any idea if there is any place at Purdue where I could keep a small bike like this?

Not quite, understeer and oversteer still occur on a bike, just not exactly in the sense that they do in cars. When a bike understeers, it tends to push out on a wider line without additional input from the rider. Normally poor weight transfer prevents the front tire from gripping enough to steer. Hanging off more to keep the bike upright helps by increasing the contact patch of the tires, or using less throttle can cure it. Giving a harder shove on the bars and manhandling the thing into position also works, but its sloppy and slowl. Oversteer is usually a little slip or push of the rear wheel on corner exit when hard on the throttle. A low side can happen from either wheel losing grip, like the front tucking under hard braking or the rear sliding out on gravel/hard acceleration/upset suspension.


A 250R is a great beginners bike. Cheap, simple, and light enough to keep up the corner speed. It'll teach you more than a 600 simply because you'll be less afraid. I've embarrassed a few bigger bikes in the twisties with mine, just because I'm less afraid to roll the throttle on full blast. It does have all the problems of a cheap bike though. The suspension is soft and bouncy, so it'll reward a clean line and punish a sloppier point and shoot method of cornering. There's lots of driveline lash and the carburation leaves a bit to be desired, so its hard to be smooth, especially with a passenger. The seat's pretty uncomfortable (for me atleast) and it runs at 10k rpm's at 80mph on the highway, which hurts its touring abilities. I've still done 300+ miles in a day though, I just regretted it afterwards.


Also, as far as Italian vs. Japanese, Japan has completely leapfrogged the Italians as far as quantifiable performance figures go. Back in the eighties and early ninties the Japanese couldn't design chassis to go with their engines, which is how Ducati et al earned their reputation for handling (as well as having v-twin engines as opposed to inline fours which allowed them more traction on corner exit, allowing the lower horsepower italian bikes to have superior acceleration). This is why specialized firms like Harris and Bimota were able to create excellent racing bikes by taking the powerful Japanese engines and mating them to a Ducati-esqe steel trellis frame. However, the Japanese have figured out how to design chassis' to go along with their more powerful engines, which is why they rule Superbike and Motogp nowadays. On the street, all that doesn't matter though so is a $30k Ducati 999R worth it? Absolutely. Italian's still have a certain feel to them that is unique (while most Jap bikes feel the identical). You also get the prestige and the top flight components that come with an exclusive bike like that. To some people it might not be worth it, but to some people it is. I know I'd rather have the 999R over a new Suzuki GSX-R1000, which is arguably superior in every performance catagory, but everybody's got a Gixxer or an R6 or a CBR or a Ninja. I'd pay the extra 20k for a true WSB homolagation Ducati. Or $20k for a Ten Kate WSB replica Honda CBR1000RR. Its just like Ferrari's and Lamborghini's. Sure there's better for cheaper, but which do you want? Some people will be happy with the alternative. Some people would buy the Ferrari. If you're not racing, it doesn't really matter which one is faster because you'll probably never take it to the limit, so get what you want.

Yeah I didn't want to overcomplicate things for Moe with the under and oversteer thing.

Aero is actually becoming more and more important in Motogp. The bikes are getting fast enough that they are generating lift while leaned over in the fast corners, so extensive wind tunnel time is being used by all the factories to minimize that. Also with fuel regulations, they have to curb fuel consumption to maintain high speeds without running out of gas (see Sete Gibernau's last lap failure in last weeks Brno GP haha). Ducati has probably done the most wind tunnel testing (or atleast admitted it), and their bike can did over 340kph at Shanghai while the Honda's averaged about 330kph.

lol, yea true. On second thought Moe, just disregard my entire post

Technically Highsides are caused when the back is sliding, the rider panics and lets off the throttle. The rear suddenly grips, and pitches the bike over in the opposite direction, and its like trying to ride a 120 mph bucking bull at that point.